[foaf-protocols] webid-linked claim verification?

Melvin Carvalho melvincarvalho at gmail.com
Sat Aug 28 18:24:20 CEST 2010


On 26 August 2010 17:35, Seth Russell <russell.seth at gmail.com> wrote:

> In other words.  I want a library with the following 4 functions ...
>
> $id = signup()
> $id = signin()
> sendMessage ($id, $message)
>

I think every webid should have a semantic inbox


> getMessage ($id, $message)
>
>
> Seth Russell
> Podcasting: tagtalking.net
> Facebook ing: facebook.com/russell.seth
> Twitter ing: twitter.com/SethRussell
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> Google profile: google.com/profiles/russell.seth
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 8:25 AM, Seth Russell <russell.seth at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Well, actually, as a website owner, i don't want to be  discerning
>> anything.  All i really want to do is just send messages to my clients.   I
>> want all that discerning to be out of my sight and concern and totally under
>> the client's control.   That is my real point here.  And, when you think
>> about it,  if the libraries take the approach of factoring all that
>> discerning into the control of the client and just let the website send (and
>> perhaps recieve) messages from the client,  then all that magic we want can
>> evolve in the libraries and my web development code can be left alone.   Me
>> thinks this is a path to a faster evolution for all those wonderful WebID
>> benefits that are being touted.
>>
>>
>> Seth Russell
>> Podcasting: tagtalking.net
>> Facebook ing: facebook.com/russell.seth
>> Twitter ing: twitter.com/SethRussell
>> Blogging: fastblogit.com/seth/
>> Catalog selling: www.speaktomecatalog.com
>> Google profile: google.com/profiles/russell.seth
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 8:01 AM, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen at openlinksw.com>wrote:
>>
>>>  On 8/26/10 8:31 AM, Seth Russell wrote:
>>>
>>> Dan Brickley said:  If we assume the possibility of a simple Web app that
>>> allows users to demonstrate simultaneous control over multiple accounts, the
>>> natural next question is re what it does with that info.
>>>
>>> Well perhaps answering that question:  one of the biggest use cases for
>>> identity on the web is where some website, say a shopping site, wants to
>>> know  who a person is ** so that they can communicate with that person **.
>>> All we, the website owners, really want is a open source library given to us
>>> with a function to call which would return some identity string to store in
>>> our local database.  When we need to send a message back to the person all
>>> we really want to do is to send a message referencing that identity string.
>>> The library takes it from there, and we, the site owners, are no longer
>>> concerned with details like verifying email addresses, twitter accounts, or
>>> even in which protocol the client prefers to get their messages.
>>>
>>> I really appreciate Dan's call for a verification of claims and hope that
>>> it will inevitably dove tail into that library i so desperately need but
>>> can't write myself.
>>>
>>>
>>> Not only can you figure out how to communicate with them. You can discern
>>> their preferred communication mechanism. You could even discern their
>>> location and bike something over to them or keep the store open a little
>>> longer (clicks and mortar scenario with some GoodRelations Linked Data
>>> sprinkled in).
>>>
>>> Kingsley
>>>
>>>
>>> Seth Russell
>>> Podcasting: tagtalking.net
>>> Facebook ing: facebook.com/russell.seth
>>> Twitter ing: twitter.com/SethRussell
>>> Blogging: fastblogit.com/seth/
>>> Catalog selling: www.speaktomecatalog.com
>>> Google profile: google.com/profiles/russell.seth
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 12:47 AM, Dan Brickley <danbri at danbri.org>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi folks
>>>>
>>>> Has anyone here built a webapp that shows verification of simple
>>>> identity-relevant claims? This idea is not tightly coupled to WebID
>>>> but would help ground WebIDs (or equally self-hosted OpenIDs) in other
>>>> identifying information.
>>>>
>>>> e.g. 1.) you go along, log in with a webid cert, and select "verify an
>>>> email address"; it sends you some generated token by email, with a
>>>> URL; you get that mail, follow the link, log in again with webid if
>>>> needed [eg. the mail might arrive tommorrow], ... after which you've
>>>> established some evidence that whoever controls that webid also
>>>> controls (for now) that mailbox.
>>>>
>>>> e.g. 2.) you go along, log in with a webid cert, and select "verify a
>>>> Web account", and choose a provider from a list of service providers
>>>> who offer OpenID, OAuth and/or proprietary API ways of allowing
>>>> someone to demonstrate control over an account. For OpenID you should
>>>> also have the ability to type in an arbitrary OpenID-enabled URL. So
>>>> here you might verify that you control http://twitter.com/example
>>>> [this would use OAuth], or a Facebook account.
>>>>
>>>> e.g. 3.) or you login with webid again, and select "verify a Chat
>>>> account"; selecting from MSN, Yahoo, AIM, or Jabber/XMPP. Actually
>>>> these things are increasingly linked to general Web profiles, but at
>>>> least Jabber/XMPP would be particularly interesting. So you'd type in
>>>> your chat address, let's say johnsmith at gmail.com for a Google Talk
>>>> one, but these can also be self-hosted XMPP servers eg.
>>>> danbri at foaf.tv. The service would send a roster join request to that
>>>> user, and if accepted, could send a click-to-verify link much as with
>>>> the email example.
>>>>
>>>> e.g. 4.) More stuff! There are no natural limits to the kinds of
>>>> claims that could be verified, or the methods applied. This is the
>>>> charm and the burden of the Semantic  Web; it's completely general.
>>>> But fact checking is hard, so there is value in picking off the more
>>>> mechanisable pieces; mobile phone / SMS numbers could be a natural
>>>> next step.
>>>>
>>>> There are a lot of 'claim graph analytics' you can do with this sort
>>>> of data, especially when linked with other social Web data (quite
>>>> naturally in named graphs, when managed in SPARQL). This is the same
>>>> kind of machinery offered by http://code.google.com/apis/socialgraph/
>>>> ... although SGAPI deals more with public crawlable assertions. If we
>>>> assume the possibility of a simple Web app that allows users to
>>>> demonstrate simultaneous control over multiple accounts, the natural
>>>> next question is re what it does with that info. Some of it could be
>>>> simply published in public (signed, date stamped etc.) or made
>>>> available over some public lookup API.
>>>>
>>>> eg. it could just emit a 'verified claims' file with simple statements,
>>>> ...
>>>> <http://example.com/johnsmith#me> a :Person; :account
>>>> <http://twitter.example.com/johnsmith>; :account
>>>> <http://facebook.example.com/jsmith/> ...
>>>>
>>>> Such info could be used as a grounding for more trust, eg. my blog
>>>> comments system could allow webid-based commenting, and auto-accept
>>>> posts that came from people whose twitter or facebook IDs I know, even
>>>> if I've not seen their webid before. Some such tool seems to me worth
>>>> building, both to show that these service activities will still exist
>>>> in a WebID world, they're just not core duties of an identity
>>>> provider. But also to counter some of the concerns I've seen raised
>>>> about self-asserted ID. Is there anything out there like this
>>>> currently?
>>>>
>>>> cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Dan
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> foaf-protocols mailing list
>>>> foaf-protocols at lists.foaf-project.org
>>>> http://lists.foaf-project.org/mailman/listinfo/foaf-protocols
>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Kingsley Idehen	
>>> President & CEO
>>> OpenLink Software
>>> Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
>>> Weblog: http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/~kidehen <http://www.openlinksw.com/blog/%7Ekidehen>
>>> Twitter/Identi.ca: kidehen
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
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